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www.kiva.net/~teckhart/
teckhart@kiva.net
TammyJo Eckhart, a dominant
sadist, has been active in the BDSM community since 1993 when she moved
to NYC to pursue a master's degree in ancient history at Columbia
University. There she became involved in TES on a semi-regular basis as
well as helping found the Columbia University group, Conversio Virium.
In 1995, she continued organizing the Applemunch, a monthly dinner for
those interested in BDSM. Her writing has been published in the
SandMUtopian Guardian, by Masquerade Books (Punishment for the Crime;
Amazons), Circlet Press (SM Futures), and Greenery Press (Justice). In
her writing and in real life, she has been told that she shatters the
common stereotypes of dominant women. An educator at heart, she
continues her direct involvement in BDSM organizations via Headspace at
the Bloomington campus of Indiana University. She helps arrange for
education panels in courses and dormitories as well as working
one-on-one with instructors who make BDSM a topic in human sexuality
classes. She has also selectively trained would-be submissives or slaves
and mentored some new tops and dominants.
As of the late spring of 2002, her
"kinky family" is comprised of Tom, her husband since 1992,
and Fox, her live-in slave/pet since 1999. She is constantly seeking new
information and opinions about BDSM even on subjects she is not
personally interested in, because as an academic she feels that one can
never know enough and should always view things with an analyzing eye.
She has been the "Featured Book Reviewer" for KinkyBooks.com
since summer 2001, and her reviews are used by several BDSM
organizations in the USA. Her republished reviews also appear on
Mischief's Fantasy Shop, as will several original reviews.
Read TammyJo's Story A
Simple Gift
Read TammyJo's Story Journey
unto Warrior
SENSUOUS SADIE: You describe
yourself as psychologically inclined, in and out of scene. What do you
mean by this?
TAMMY JO: For me, Ds is really the important part of BDSM. I interact
with the world, I process the world through a Ds lens. That, however,
doesn't mean that I treat everyone like they are submissive to me,
because I can see the inequalities and I want people to be aware of
them. I believe in informed consent, and sometimes that means thinking a
lot. Consent isn't just a BDSM issue -- we should expect to be able to
give or withhold our consent in many areas of our lives.
"Ds is also individual and partner-based. What I expect from my
submissives or slaves is not what someone else may expect and
vice-versa. What my slave wears specifically doesn't matter, but why he
chooses to wear something does. It's what is going on inside our heads
and how we communicate that is very important to me -- the externals can
be symbols, rituals, or actions that indicate what is going on inside,
but they are meaningless without the inner Ds dynamic."
Sadie: You believe "that
human religious organizations often misinterpret and misrepresent the
true message of Christianity." How do your BDSM beliefs fit into
the larger Christian faith?
TammyJo: "I'm afraid that Christianity has been so utterly
humanized and has left its historical path so far behind that I may soon
decide that the term does not describe my relationship with the Divine.
"For me, Christianity was about self-awareness (but then many
religions could claim the same thing, yes?). Look at yourself, take care
of yourself, know you are loved and that you can survive whatever you
have to live through now, even if surviving means moving onto the next
world. Then help others. Help means to be an example, to share the
necessities of life, and to be a support if that support is accepted.
Help never means to force your beliefs on another, monitor and report on
your neighbors when they don't conform to your way, or ignore suffering
when you see it.
"I think that consent is really at the center of a lot of these
ideas I have -- how to be able to give or withhold consent, how to
express that consent, and how to respect that consent. For me consent is
the foundation of BDSM; it is what separates it from all the historical
and legal definitions of the words we use to identify aspects of BDSM.
If there were better words to use, our lives would be easier, but hey --
some of those words turn me on too, so I need to be sure that underneath
them is consent; for me that means informed consent."
Sadie: You did a concentration in
women's studies for your undergraduate degree in ancient Greco-Roman
civilizations. Does your interest in this extend to women in
contemporary society? How has your study of women's history affected
your BDSM philosophy?
TammyJo: "My minor for my PhD is women's history as well. And yes,
issues of gender extend throughout human history for me, but as a
historian I also know we are seriously limited by the surviving
evidence. It is all too easy to let our own personal biases color our
understanding of the past or of other cultures.
"In terms of affecting my philosophy: it hasn't. Consent has always
been my foundation in all of my human interactions. Or as I tell my
students: my syllabus is my contract with you for this course; if you
think it is unfair or is asking too much then you need to drop the
class, because if you stay I assume you have agreed to our
contract."
Sadie: As a card carrying member
of NOW as well as other women's organizations, how do you respond to
some BDSM players who feel that submissive women in the BDSM community
are not able to make this choice truly freely because of our cultural
conditioning?
TammyJo: "Let me be very clear: there are people who believe that
they are submissive but do not seem to be able to give informed consent
to be submissive, either because of their past, because they are
confused about what the roles involve, or because they blindly follow
the culture around them. This group includes both males and females of
all ages, sexual orientations, etc.
"I'm not submissive, so I honestly can't say that I've ever had to
answer the question you pose. I've been asked/told that I'm not really
dominant because I'm female or because I'm primarily heterosexual --
I've been told this by people in the BDSM community, by people on the
political/religious right, and by people on the political/religious
left.
"Quite frankly, I don't think that anyone has a right to assume
anything about my relationships, but if they wish to ask polite
questions then they are welcomed to do so.
"Let me confess that for years I had a 'prove it' sort of mentality
about male dominants and female submissives -- not that the couple had
to answer to me, but that I had to see some signs of love and caring
there before I, in my own mind, could be comfortable around that couple.
It would have never occurred to me to say anything out loud to those
people, because that would be very rude.
"Why did I have this gut-level reaction? Because of my own past of
abuse, which I thought was merely male-on-female -- I've sadly learned
that my own family of origin is messed up in very complicated ways, and
it can't be broken down into gender or sex dynamics. But I also reacted
this way because I'm so focused on the inner Ds dynamic. Why did
dominant men and submissive women need to do BDSM? Couldn't they just be
in a traditional marriage? Once more I was trying to see the world in
simple terms.
"If there is one thing years of BDSM, years of writing, and years
of studying history have taught me, it is that nothing involving human
beings is ever simple or easy."
Sadie: You had an early interest
in power dynamics. How did that manifest itself in your childhood?
TammyJo: "Mostly in how I remember television shows and books,
because I was drawn to the 'Amazon' episodes and images that conformed
to my internal view of how the world should be.
"In my own life, however, the power dynamic was a constant
struggle, which I lost a lot until I was older. Most of the time I was
really only comfortable alone, or in relationships that were equal or
where I was the leader.
"Being leader never meant just being the boss -- it meant gathering
information from everyone involved, thinking through the choices, and
then getting people to follow by validating them and checking in with
them through any activity or interaction."
Sadie: You are open about the
fact that you are an abuse survivor, and how that can sometimes affect
those who become deeply involved with you. Have you found that your
surviving this abuse has added a dimension to your BDSM relationships?
TammyJo: "Perhaps it is part of what pushes me to be so focused on
consent -- my consent was ignored, and I never want anyone else to ever
have to go through that.
"It also unfortunately means that I tend to attract folks that are
also from abusive backgrounds, sometimes people who haven't moved from
victim to survivor yet but are just existing. It can be very hot to be a
savior, but it is also very scary and potentially quite harmful to
everyone involved.
"When you help someone grow from victim to survivor it is amazing,
but odds are they won't stick around with you for the long term, because
it means that they change and your relationship changes too
dramatically. Also, some people do not seem able or willing to grow from
victim to survivor.
"Getting kind of intense here.
"In terms of activities in BDSM that relate to my survivor status,
I don't do things like verbal abuse or pretend to be a rapist or abuser
very well, because it is just too 'real' to me. I also can't do very
young types of roleplaying because my own sexual abuse happened when I
was quite young, so once more it's too 'real' to me."
Sadie: You have been described as
flirting in a dominant manner. What do you think this means?
TammyJo: "I have no idea! This is a question I always ask the
people who tell me this. The response is usually, 'You just do.'"
Sadie: You commented that for a
short time you went to a polyamorous group, but found that you didn't
relate to that style. Since many couples in d/s are polyamorous, what
are the key differences you find between being poly for its own sake,
and poly as it manifests in our community?
TammyJo: "I'm not sure that the difference you mention is real on
any community level. There are folks I know who can have vanilla sex
with anyone, but not BDSM or certain types of BDSM. There are folks I
know who can have BDSM interactions with anyone, but not vanilla sex or
certain types of vanilla sex. There are people who can 'play' but can't
get serious with others. It really depends on the people involved.
"The poly group in our community was really vanilla, and it seemed
focused on circles of lovers and fuckbuddies. That isn't for me. I'm not
poly because I want sex with a lot of people; I'm poly because I can
love a lot of people, and for me love is not the same as sex.
"For me, poly is about creating adult families where loyalty and
affection aren't limited by number but by the heart and the consent of
everyone involved.
"Someone once told me that I was the most monogamous poly person
she knew. I think what she meant was that I was very loyal, very
focused, on the people already in my life. I can be and am happy with
husband and slave, but I could also be happy with another slave or with
my spouse getting a 'mommy' as long as everyone was honest and cared
about each other."
Sadie: You said in your interview
with Jack Rinella that "for women still, sexy often means being
submissive. I've learned to be sexy through sm, I don't have to play
those little games." Can you explain what you mean by this? How do
you now express your own sexuality? Is it tied inextricably to BDSM, or
do you also have a vanilla side?
TammyJo: "Vanilla is not a flavor I like in ice cream, drinks, or
sex -- but remember that for me, Ds is the important thing, so what you
may see me doing can look very vanilla.
"I think American society still tells females to pose and bait and
trick and wait -- look passive, look submissive -- while telling males
to act and take and grab and claim -- look active, look dominant. If we
look at many other animals we see that often the males are both the
physically attractive ones and the active pursuers, yet we've divided
these roles up in our sexes.
"In no way am I trying to say that we are dictated to by biological
factors; I think that is another simplistic view of human beings that is
doomed to prove incorrect. What I am saying is that any attempt to force
someone into a box, a role, be it based on anything other than their own
being, is limiting and will fail at some level.
"There are few acceptable outlets for the non-traditional sexuality
of women -- heck, even some 'feminists' promote the traditional
sexuality when they say that women can't consent to or can't have
heterosexual sex. But BDSM ideally has a variety of roles that you can
fit to yourself -- but even here there are stereotypes. I'm not a
stereotype; I suspect many folks might never think I was into BDSM at
all, because I don't fit a stereotype."
Sadie: Fetish dressing is rather
a large part of the scene. (In fact I wrote a few columns on this
topic). What are your feelings about not getting into the dressing up
part? What kinds of strategies do you use to "set the scene"
considering that you may not look any different than if you were doing
the laundry?
TammyJo: "It's really attitude for me. I can dominant in teddy bear
slippers if I want, or a nice black outfit. It is truly attitude that I
care about. I am careful to wear primarily black at BDSM events if it is
at all possible for me to do so out of respect for the community's
standards. But I won't attend something that requires fetish clothing or
dictates how people in particular roles must interact, because I think
that really denies the individual the right to be herself and just
creates another box to shove someone into.
"I haven't been in a non-24/7 relationship for over two years now,
so explaining what I do to 'set the scene' is difficult to even grasp in
my mind. So I'm going to approach the question as a 'special play time'
or a 'role playing session' situation.
"It depends on what we are doing. If I'm a spoiled princess who
receives a very talented slave for a present, then I'll dress up, put on
aristocratic sounding music (very very low volume), and use plural
pronouns to refer to myself. If we are doing a flogging, then I need to
get my equipment ready and be in clothing I can move in. If we are doing
knife play, I need to make sure I have appropriate safety supplies and
that I make our space as private and quiet as possible."
Sadie: You've been married since
1992. How did you negotiate boundaries with your spouse regarding other
partners?
TammyJo: "Each of us (this applies to my slave and I as well) needs
to keep the other informed of new interests. We need to meet the new
interest. We have a right to express any concerns or limits, but we do
not have a right to say 'that one or me,' unless we feel there is a
safety issue. We let each other know when we will be spending time with
another partner and offer to share as many details as we are asked. We
make sure we make time for each other and let each other know that we
care. Nothing works perfectly, however, so communication is the
foundation."
Sadie: You have fairly strict
rules about who you will engage with, saying that you "will no
longer scene with someone whom I do not feel a connection with, who does
not share a great deal of compatible interests with me, and who is not
willing to commit to a negotiated contract." How do you screen out
the large number of people who are not a good match for you?
TammyJo: "I'm demanding.
"You'd be surprised how many 'wannas' will disappear if you ask for
a list of past partners, or set up a meeting in a restaurant, or require
an essay to be written. Add into that the fact that I do not have
genital sex with the vast majority of my BDSM partners and that I'm
looking for long-term relationships, and it weeds out a lot of people.
"After a while you get a reputation for being very selective, and
the non-compatibles stop appearing so often.
"Sometimes I wish I could do the casual or SM buddy stuff -- they
look like they have a lot of fun, and they go to all the parties. I'm
just not wired that way, especially not for anything with Ds in it. I
did have a knifeplay buddy for several months, and that was fun and
cool, but we were friends first, so there really was a relationship
there. With that type of focused SM stuff I could see having an SM
buddy. But at this time, there just really isn't anyone around here who
I think would be happy in that type of relationship."
Sadie: You have some harem
fantasies. Are you hoping or planning to have these submissives/bottoms
live with you and your husband? If so, how will you manage the house for
optimal peace?
TammyJo: "Fox, my slave, has moved in for a trial 15-month period.
He lived with us during the past two summers but now won't be moving
back to campus when the fall semester starts. Fox and Tom (my spouse)
like each other; if they didn't, Fox and I couldn't be doing what we are
because it just would not be the sort of poly relationship I want and
need.
"Fox lives a few floors below us, so he has his own room (it used
to be my dungeon actually). He pays a minimal rent to help support the
family as well as picking up his costs of special events like getting a
cable modem to network all our computers or when we go out to a
restaurant. He has his own friends and his own time -- as do Tom and I.
We've worked out a family schedule of when we each are working or doing
something on a regular basis so we can see what will work when we want
to schedule family time or couple time.
"But then as you may have guessed by now, I have my own definition
of what a slave is, so I'm sure my description reads very odd to some
folks. He is my property, but he may not look like property to your eyes
and ears.
"I would deal with each addition on an individual basis --
everybody has to work together; everybody has to get along. And
everybody contributes to the income of the household."
Sadie: You write, "since I
am only interested in relationships, I frown upon one-time scenes."
Considering that much of the BDSM culture is predicated on play parties
and other kinds of more "casual" play, where do you fit in the
continuum? How do you screen for partners?
TammyJo: "I'm not a party person. Nothing against parties, those
who go or those who put a lot of hard work into having them, but I'm
just not that type of people. Because what I do is so internal or so
edgy, it doesn't work well in crowded, loud and often rather dark
environments.
"Yet I actually encourage folks to get a variety of partners,
especially when they are starting out in the scene. I think it helps you
learn and it helps you figure out if any particular relationship is good
for you because you have more experiences to base your choices on.
"I have gone to parties, though I'm more likely to attend
'educational' events in dungeons than the average play party. I've been
a DM and I've even hosted. I find it very stressful to be with so many
people -- maybe I'm too concerned about not being a stereotype or
looking silly.
"I do like to watch, however, and I'm far more likely to be at a
party or dungeon (slave in tow to buffer me against the single men who
seem to be a plague at some of these places) and just watch."
Sadie: You state that you are
looking for a submissive who "who is strong enough to help me when
I cry and who can also feel free to cry and be held by me." How do
you respond to people who feel that dominants should not be showing what
may be perceived as weakness to their submissives?
TammyJo: "I think that relationships and activities are only
healthy for us if they allow and encourage us to be ourselves. The real
TammyJo cries, laughs, gets angry, worries, changes her mind, takes care
of others, and sometimes just wants to be a child. If someone thinks
that me being me is weak, then that is not a healthy relationship for me
to be in. If someone is telling folks that X role must behave in X way,
then they aren't interested in people; they are only interested in
stereotypes. I feel sorry for folks like that -- it must be difficult to
so compartmentalize your life like this."
Sadie: It appears from your
website that your husband Tom does not participate in your BDSM life. Is
this correct? What is it like for him being married to someone who is so
well known in our community?
TammyJo: "Tom is kinky, but he has his own particular fetishes and
role preferences that do not mix well with my own. Part of us realizing
that poly was far healthier for us was being honest about the fact that
in order to scene together both of us were compromising too much and not
content with anything we were getting.
"He's actually been a big part of the two university groups we've
been in -- he has been on both boards or steering committees and has
done workshops. Just because his kink isn't as common or as well
documented doesn't mean that he isn't kinky and can't be part of the
community.
"As for how he feels, you'd have to ask him that (flint@kiva.net).
"Am I well known? I guess so; it doesn't really feel that way a
good deal of the time. But then what would that feel like?"
Sadie: You are a prolific writer
of erotica. Does it turn you on when you write it? Or is more about the
writing itself when you're actually doing the writing?
TammyJo: "I'm not prolific enough -- only three collections out so
far. I don't put my stuff on the web until it's been copyrighted to me
via publication, except on my 'fan club,' where I've asked folks to
never ever give out what I share with them. Plus too many people are
willing to get the junk for free on the Internet and buy the junk from
cheap publishing houses, so if you are a good erotica writer you are
kind of screwed, and not in a good way. Some of what I write always
turns me on. But not everything write is a turn-on -- I write what would
be appropriate in that world or for that character or for that
situation. I'm often surprised at what readers find to be the turn-ons
or the message of a piece, which just shows me that no matter how
careful and how detailed, a lot of written work is in the mind of the
reader.
"Sometimes I challenge myself to write about a particular topic or
in a particular style, and that can be both a turn-on and a trial. I
think I'm like many writers I've met -- I write because I have to,
because it's part of me."
Sadie: You enjoy watching the
difference between how heterosexual men and woman react when hearing
your stories read out loud. What is the difference that you observe? To
what do you attribute it?
TammyJo: "If women attend a reading, they seem to be more open
to what they are hearing; they seem less concerned with the sex of the
characters and more concerned with the images. Some men must attend a
reading for some reason I really can't understand, because they can
clearly become embarrassed or even feel they need to leave while I'm
reading. I usually have more women talk to me after a reading than men
-- maybe the mainstream paradigm in our culture of men as dominant makes
them feel uncomfortable to talk to me after a reading. I mean, all of my
stories have male submissives in them, so that just slaps at the
traditional culture immediately."
Sadie: What are some of the BDSM
books you've most enjoyed reviewing and why?
TammyJo: "I love the writings of Laura Antoniou and Kyle Stone,
because they focus on people first and take the time to create fairly
elaborate fiction.
"I like the non-fiction by John Warren, Jay Wiseman and Janet
Hardy, Jack Rinella, and Charles Moser, because I think they take care
to promote this individual aspect of BDSM that I think is truly healthy.
They also tend to stick to realities that we have to deal with.
"Then there are people I'd call the 'academics' of the BDSM
community, like Gail Rubin, Mark Thompson, and Ivo Dominguez, who track
the history, analyze our present and challenge us to be more.
"My list in no way should be seen as the 'only' people whose work I
really like -- I'm reading and reviewing so much that the most honest
answer to your question would be 'read all my reviews.' Not every work
by a person will be their best; that's true of me as well."
Sadie: What are the things that
really irritate you in BDSM books?
TammyJo: "Focus on size and objects over people. Beginning a story
but finishing it suddenly with no real conclusion. Unrealistic equipment
or physical interactions -- hey, make it science fiction if you want
more freedoms with the body or technology. Not doing what the author
claims they are going to do -- this is my biggest pet peeve. Promoting a
'one true way' or a 'biologically determined way' for everyone in the
world. Internal contradictions. Poor organization."
Sadie: How does it feel to be
having someone so close to you, your husband, reading and commenting on
your writing before it goes to press? Do you find that he has a similar
response to your readership in general?
TammyJo: "I wish I'd hear from my readers (especially those who
read my fiction) more. A good message can make my week and help motivate
me to write more.
"I think that Tom (and now Fox too) is the only person who could
get away with saying things like 'what the hell are you trying to say in
this sentence' or making very honest suggestions. I trust him to do what
is best for me, and my own defensive walls don't go up as high or as
fast around him."
Sadie: Is there anything else
you'd like to share with our readers?
TammyJo: "I just want to encourage everyone to buy books, journals,
and magazines that are created by and for BDSM practitioners. There is
too much incorrect, poorly done, and frankly sometimes dangerous
information on the web today. We need to invest more time and money in
those who are willing to teach and share themselves through their
writing, publishing, and organizational work. Our lives are busy, and it
can be very hard to give and give with little in return, so please
respect copyrights, invest in the organizations and publications that
are there for you, and give positive feedback, not just negative
feedback, when you can."
Sadie: Thank you very much!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sensuous
Sadie is the author of It's Not
About the Whip: Love, Sex, and Spirituality in the BDSM Scene (http://www.trafford.com/robots/03-0551.html).
She is the founder and leader (1999 - 2001) of
Rose
&
Thorn
,
Vermont
's first BDSM group.
Comments, compliments and complaints, as well as requests for reprinting
can be addressed to her at SensuousSadie@aol.com
or visit her website at www.sensuoussadie.com. Sadie believes the universe is abundant, and that sharing information
freely is part of this abundance, so she allows reprints of her writing
in most venues.
Copyright
2003 Sadie Sez Publications
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