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Interview with Mikhael Yowe |
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Interview with Mikhael Yowe, Mr. Empire State Leather 2006
dragonbrother3@yahoo.com This interview originally ran in Power Exchange Magazine in the Fall of 2007 Portraits of Mikhael
Yowe by Sadie
Mikhael Yowe is Mr. Empire State Leather 2006. He identifies as Native American and has studied many aspects of spirituality. Mikhael (pronounced Michael) has been into S&M for 30 years, identifies as a Bear, and lives in southern Vermont. He is working on a 39-year relationship with his soul mate Sylvia and is Co-Founder and current Senior Vice President of the Green Mountain Leather Club in Barre, Vermont. His claim to fame is the use of his "tiny little sticks."
Sadie: You are Mr. Empire State Leather, which for those of you who aren’t in the New England area is New York. How did you come to have this title and what motivated you to get involved in this process? Mikhael: "My brothers in our leather club set me up. The founder asked me if I would like to compete and the other brothers knocked down every excuse that I could think of. Clothing was my biggest excuse but formal wear and everything else just jumped right out at me. That’s why I think it was a set up. I went, knowing that I would not win. I was determined to have a good time and give it my best. Boy was I wrong. I had a blast and I won. It has been one of the best things that have ever happened to me. I had to reexamine my reality and get on board with the rest of the titleholders. I have met some really beautiful people out there." Sadie: You’re also the co-founder and Senior Vice-President of one of our Vermont groups, the Green Mountain Leather Club. What is your focus as a group leader? Mikhael: "Keeping my president sane…{laughter}. Furby (our prez) calls me his ball breaker. I can only hope that it is an affectionate term. {smile} Our purpose is to show the world that different sexes can co-exist in the leather world. I’ve had women come up to me and ask if there is a women’s group. When I tell them that we would love to have them hang out with us, I think it frightens some of them. We have several women in our group and hopefully that number will continue to grow. "We’re also trying to take the fear out of leather. Leather has such a "bad Boy" Image and we are showing people that there are other aspects." Sadie: You identify as a Bear yourself. Obviously that has something to do with your physicalness, being a rugged guy and all. But I think you also feel that there is a spiritual sensibility about that identity and that you foster a certain state of mind. Could you talk a little bit about this? Mikhael: "Bears historically were a sub group of the gay community; marginalized because of our size and hairiness. I think, way back when, it wasn’t a good thing. Now, Bears have become mainstream and developed an identity on their own. "I feel that I have overcome the Stigma of not being that perfect person that the rest of the gay community expected and just found myself amongst the ruins. Is that spiritual? I think so. I’ve stepped away from intolerance from all different directions and into a place of tolerance for those that have oppressed me. It puts me in a place of inner peace. I’m happy with my body, even with its shortfalls. I know that I can’t please everyone and I don’t try. I don’t make excuses for me. If there is a problem about who I am, it comes from them not me." Sadie: In addition to the leather group you’re also involved in the Green Mountain Growlers. You’ve joked with me that it’s all about the food, but I suspect it’s quite a bit more. For those of us who aren’t that familiar with what a Bear group is all about, can you explain a little of what the focus of the group is? Mikhael: "The Growlers are a social group. We get together and have potlucks and game nights and other such things. It is all about the food for me. From the eye candy to the dessert and on to the "I’m so full all I want to do is lay around and rub someone’s belly". Bears are a sensuous lot. Real touchy feely kinda guys. I love rubbing bellies with another bear. For some of the guys though, it is the only social outlet they have. This is Vermont ya know. We don’t even have a Gay bar here. "Movie nights are my favorite. We watch movies that would seem uncool by all standards. My favorite is "Finding Nemo" and my second would have to be "Shrek". It is so very cool to me to see thirty or so big burly men laughing their butts off over a kid’s movie or crying over some sappy romance. Jez, "Cinderella" with Drew Barrymore had everyone in tears. Oh, Never, Never walk in front of the screen. They will actually throw stuff at you. "Sometimes, we get caddy with the movies and really get cranked up with running commentaries, which is a laugh in itself, but mostly it’s about cuddling up with the bear next to you and watching a good flick." Sadie: One of the stories you told me that really moved me was about your friend Jeff who is a short Asian man who also identifies as a Bear, even though he of course is not at all a big husky guy. Would you tell that story again for our readers and the feelings you have about this that you shared with him? Mikhael: "Jeffery is a wonderful little Behr (his spelling) who buys his Car-harts in the kids department. He’s under 5 feet and less than 90 lbs. I affectionately call him Tigger, because when he’s excited he bounces all the time. "I can so relate to Jeffery because he sees himself a Trans-Behr, a huge bear trapped in a tiny Asian body. He struggles with his Behr image and how he is not always accepted by the bear community. We have spent many hours talking about how to get others to accept us as trans people and have always come back to the understanding that it is not about them, it’s about us. When we accept ourselves for who we are and how we are, then others will accept us or not. It’s not about them. If they can’t see the Behr within, then they lose out on the wonder that lies just under the surface. So many people overlook the love of their life because they have misconceived ideas about what they need or have an image fixed in their mind about whom they want to be seen in with. That is very sad to me. "Jeffery met a wonderful bear at Drenched Fur. Two bears called their friend and told him to get his butt over to the party (he lives two hours from Erie) because they had seen a wonderful little Asian bear that seemed to be alone. Jeffery was at the party with my submissive Tim and I. They have been dating every since. I can only hope that my friends are watching out for me in such a beautiful way." Sadie: Even though you are strongly active in these groups, which are primarily gay, you actually are bisexual and are married to your soul mate Sylvia. I wonder if that affects how you are accepted into those groups? Mikhael: "I think at first it did. The guys looked at me funny. Some of them just came right out and asked me what I was doing there. I told them that I was a bear and I came to be with other bears. They really couldn’t argue with that. "The leather group has a completely different take on things. Some of them think that because I’m trans that makes me some kind of strange lesbian and some think that I’m an exotic new kind of meat." Sadie: You have a remarkable ability to share your attention and love, and have two additional Submissives, one male and one female, the second being myself at the moment. What are the differences that you observe in playing with male versus female Submissives? Mikhael: "I think male subs are easier to deal with. Men tend to compartmentalize emotional things in their lives and so things don’t get all jumbled up in a pile. Women don’t. I can say this because I’ve been there. The after care is where everyone is the most vulnerable emotional and that is where I see the biggest difference. Men will allow caressing and being held for just so long and then they need to break the connection. It differs between straight and gay men in length, but the break is always there. "Women have to be disconnected from the scene. I have to do the guy thing here and break away. Women who are in touch with their male side will do the breaking away, it just takes longer. You can almost see the struggle within. I want to stay…get away. J " Sadie: What kind of challenges have you faced in your marriage vis-à-vis your other Submissives? How have you negotiated these things with Sylvia, considering that your love and commitment to her are rock solid? Mikhael: "Communication, Communication, Communication. It’s so important to talk. "Sylvia and I are soul mates. We have clear and precise boundaries in where we can go and what we can do. I share my experiences with her and vise-versa. "I have to hold on tight to those boundaries or my subs could feel unappreciated. The intimacy of our relationship could run amuck and everyone could get hurt."
Sadie: You identify spiritually as a Native American. How does this element of your spirituality get expressed through your BDSM play? Mikhael: "Traditionally Native Americans practiced purification of self through suffering. This was done through self-mutilation and depravation. I believe that suffering brings about a sense of responsibility not to just oneself but to others. That responsibility is manifested through protecting others, being an example of power, and walking the path that was given to you at birth. "How can someone understand the pain of childbirth without going through it themselves? How can someone be compassionate if their life was always filled with joy?" Sadie: You’ve been described as a teacher of spiritual things. Would you agree? What do you think you’ve been put here to teach specifically? Mikhael: "The trials and tribulations in my life have in some way set me up as a teacher. I believe the path that has drawn me along for years now is one of teaching. I’m not a gentle teacher as I was never a gentle student. Sometimes I mean to say one thing, but something altogether different comes out of my mouth. I am also here to listen so that others can hear who they truly are in their own words. I believe that I am a mirror to shine your crap back to you so that you will see yourself for who you truly are and then hopefully fix it. When I run into someone who is in the process it is wonderful because they can see how far they have come. It encourages them to continue the journey." Sadie: Something that not too many people know about you is that you are transgendered female to male, and had your operation some twenty years ago. This is particularly interesting I think to many because you are particularly masculine looking. I know there are many issues around this in the vanilla community, but I’m wondering what kind of issues you might have encountered in the BDSM community, which is said to be so much more open-minded? Mikhael: "Overall, I can say that most people that get to know me are usually OK with the trans thing. I choose whom I tell and whom I don’t, based on how it will affect them. Some people can’t handle dealing with anything unusual. It isn’t my place to upset their world unnecessarily. It can also be dangerous for me as some men (and it’s mostly men) feel threatened by who I am. I haven’t figured out why that is, unless it is about their self-image." Sadie: One of the things I find sexy about you is that you have a strong feminine spirit, even though you have a masculine sensibility. You clearly have your male and female sides well integrated. Why do you think this is so difficult for so many male Dominants in the scene? Mikhael: "Not all males are even connected to their female side. Some don’t even want to go there. I think that some hetero men think that it will make them gay or something. They fight that connection tooth and nail. They miss out on so much. "Being in touch with my female side gives me a very deep insight into female subs. I can use that femininity to challenge them and therefore enhance their experience. There is a tenderness there that unconnected males can’t feel. It gives me an edge when I work with subs." Sadie: Transgender people are known throughout history to have played roles that tend toward the spiritual. Do you think this aspect of your personality has moved you more toward the spiritual aspect of yourself? Mikhael: "My journey to find myself and become the best that I can be is most definitely a spiritual one. To walk this path and not find your inner God would be a travesty. It would also mean that you’re not working through all the programming and shit that has been piled on your shoulders. As far as I’m concerned people like that are just going through the motions and don’t truly know who they are. They usually find themselves in the bottom of a bottle or pillbox somewhere, or worse, dead. "When I got to the point of ending my life with a 12 gauge, I came to understand that I had to do something. That something was to find myself in all the conditioning and programming of my domestication. Who I found was this wonderful man that was full of life and love. One who could give freely of himself without becoming lost in the drama of life. "Just think what the world would be like if every human being made that journey into self-discovery. WOW!" Sadie: I quoted you in one of my articles where you said that, "I feel that the foundation of the relationship between a Dominant and a Submissive is respect, and that fundamentally if I don’t respect a Submissive I’ll abuse him or her. Part of this is respect for the Submissive and who they are as a whole person, accepting all of who they are and not disrespecting their limits. But the other part is about respecting yourself first as a man and as a Dominant." When you talk about respecting yourself, where does that respect come from for you? And how would you tell a Submissive to look for that in a potential Dominant? Mikhael: "It comes from looking inward at myself. A long time ago I embraced the darkness in my own soul. Looking at the ugly side of myself released the fear that each of us carries within ourselves. Popeye said it best when he said, "I am what I am". Millions of children and some adults listened to that phrase countless times and no one got it. "We are domesticated (just like dogs) when we are children. Everything has a negative outcome. We learn "No" and "Bad" before we learn our own names. We are punished before we understand what it even means "to be bad". When our spirits are broken then and only then do we get to know what love is. Sometimes that is never. " Punishment is so entrenched in us that we pass it down through our children without even thinking about it. Our self-esteem comes into play here. If our parents don’t help us build it, then we have to struggle through the process ourselves. Some people never accomplish this. They never understand love in any form much less the self-love that is so important in BDSM. For me love equates to respect. "People with no self-respect are drawn to the BDSM community because they can find punishment there, or they can find someone to punish. That is the dregs in the bottom of the barrel. The real elixir is on the very top." Sadie: You’ve also written in speaking about sophisticated Dominants that, "There is one level of patience while you get to understand your Submissive deeply and honor their inner spirit. But there’s another level that people don’t often talk about, and that’s the patience of knowing yourself and being able to make your intimate self-open to others. What that means is that I have to have the patience to allow my Submissive to understand me as well, all of me – which includes my strengths as well as my weaknesses. I’m often open about things like the abuse I suffered growing up, because it allows others to connect with me in a way that they couldn’t have if they thought I was without pain or fear. It makes me human, and in that I become a whole being, a Dominant who will see my Submissive’s wholeness as well." Do you ever fear that in opening up your inner self that you will become too vulnerable? Do you think that perhaps a Submissive might not want to think of their Dominant as vulnerable in this way? Mikhael: "I got past the vulnerability stage a long time ago. Vulnerability is in the mind. People who use (or try to use) it against me are basically playing (or trying to) play mind fuck games. I don’t play those games. I truly don’t feel that they have a place in BDSM play. "Mind games are simply reinforcing our domestication as children. If we are into BDSM, we should have overcome that programming a long time ago. "Knowing my weaknesses and sharing them with my Submissive doesn’t make me vulnerable, it makes me strong. It says, "I already know who I am and I’m ok, what about you"? "If a Submissive doesn’t get this, then it is not healthy for us to play. That Submissive will not be able to find the subtle intimacy in the play and will only go away being beaten. I am not there to beat someone, I am there to love someone." Sadie: How would you describe your overall approach to Dominance? Mikhael: "Someone has to want to be dominated before I can dominate them. It is not a power struggle were I want to break or force them into a subservient position. It is a place of mutual respect; I expect them to be who they are suppose to be at that moment, nothing more and nothing less. They should have the same expectations. If I’m being wishy-washy then how can they play with me in the true sense. "When I’m in Dom mode I am a king among men, they obey because they love their king and because disobedience is unthinkable. By being their king I have a responsibility to them. I protect, nurture and punish according to how I see the situation." Sadie: One of your specialties is your "tiny little sticks" which are very thin dowels, which you play on a Submissive’s body, creating a beautiful sound and feeling. Where do you come from mentally and emotionally as a Dominant in this kind of play? Mikhael: "Those tiny little sticks are deceiving. They can caress you or open you up to bleed. It is the place in between that we search for. "Mentally I have to be on top of my game or I can hurt my Sub. I never play tired. I don’t drink or drug before, during or after play and neither does my Sub. "I think the whole point is to be emotionally present. (chuckle) Most people never seek out their emotions. God forbid that we do something like that. That takes us back to our childhood and all that programming. Run away Run away. "Isn’t this what it’s all about. We were separated from our emotions, told to "suck it up". Think about this for a moment. Some of us understand the need to reach within ourselves and feel (and I mean REALLY FEEL) our emotions. This brings us closer to who we really are as a non-domesticated human being. This brings us closer to GOD. When we get that close to GOD there is no greater feeling in the world. That is why so many people believe that BDSM is about sex. The only other place we can find that feeling is when we orgasm." Sadie: Is there anything else you’d like to share with our readers? Mikhael: "BDSM is not for everyone. If you’re afraid to open up to who you are and to whom you’re playing with, then go home. Stay in the vanilla world where you belong." Sadie: Thank you very much for chatting with me!
Sensuous Sadie is the author of Spiritual
Transformation through BDSM; Stories and Submissions from Fellow
Travelers. Read an excerpt and more at Sadie's Kinky Goodies
http://www.sensuoussadie.com/sadieskinkygoodies.htm. She is the founder
and leader (1999 - 2001) of Rose & Thorn, Vermont's first BDSM group.
Comments, compliments and complaints, as well as requests for reprinting
can be addressed to her at SensuousSadie@aol.com or visit her website at
http://www.sensuoussadie.com/. Sadie believes the universe is abundant,
and that sharing information freely is part of this abundance, so she
allows reprints of her writing in most venues.
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